Talk:Ich-Laut

The fact that Germans have different words for ich-Laut and ach-Laut leads me to believe it is not entirely accurate to say that they are allophones. German speakers hear and speak them as different sounds (at least in those dialects that maintain the difference) just as English speakers hear two different "th" sounds. CyborgTosser (Only half the battle) 21:21, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

The Germany phonology by Klaus Kohler in the IPA Handbook specifically states that [x], [ç] and [χ] are to be considered allophones of the phoneme /x/. That they are differentiated from each other by native Germans does not mean that they are seperare phonemes. The English sounds that are both spelled "th" are however in phonemical contrast to one another. Just compare the minimal pair "thigh" /θaɪ/ and "thy" /ðaɪ/.

However, I don't quite see the merit of having a seperate entry for a specifically German layman's term for a voiceless palatal fricative, which isn't even unique to German. I think this is best covered in German phonology and therefor should be merged with that article and perhaps be redirected to voiceless palatal fricative.

Peter Isotalo 09:43, May 8, 2005 (UTC)

Should definitely be merged. — Chameleon 12:26, 26 May 2005 (UTC)